That’s Debatable!

Welcome to ‘That’s Debatable!’, the weekly podcast of the Free Speech Union. Hosts Tom Harris and Jan Macvarish – both staffers at the FSU – talk about the free speech controversies that have erupted in the past week and interview some of the main protagonists in those dramas. Edited by Jason Clift. Please like, subscribe and share. Thank you.

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Episodes

22 minutes ago

With the FSU’s backing, Lucy Connolly, jailed for a tweet about migrants that she posted following the Southport murders, has been fighting her 31-month sentence in the Court of Appeal. Although a verdict was expected on Thursday when the hearing concluded, the Court will now be providing a written judgement, somewhat vaguely scheduled for “as soon as possible”. Allison Pearson has written a powerful piece about the ongoing saga in the Telegraph. A member of the FSU’s legal advisory council, Andrew Tettenborn, has written in Spiked about the European Commission’s threat to bring legal proceedings against Ireland for allegedly failing to comply with a 2008 framework decision that seeks to criminalise Holocaust denial or trivialisation of the Holocaust or other crimes against humanity. As Andrew points out, Ireland has had hate speech laws of its own since 1989 and even imposed a law last year that increases the length of prison sentences for certain crimes that are proved to be motivated by hate. We end today’s episode with a discussion around Helen Joyce’s recent appearance on BBC Woman’s Hour.
‘That's Debatable!’  is edited by Jason Clift.

Licence to Offend

Tuesday May 13, 2025

Tuesday May 13, 2025

Julian Foulkes, a retired Special Constable, was arrested and held in a cell for eight hours over a tweet warning about the threat to British Jews posed by the pro-Palestinian marches. In October of 2023, he responded to another tweet criticising Suella Braverman for describing the pro-Palestinian protests that were sweeping the country in the aftermath of the massacre in Southern Israel as ‘hate marches’. As reported in the Telegraph, the day after someone complained about Julian’s tweet, six police officers turned up at his home, ransacked the premises, arrested him, detained him for eight hours and gave him a caution. Julian retained the services of a solicitor and, with his help, got Kent Police to admit they’d made a mistake and delete the caution from his record. Julian, who has now joined the Free Speech Union, is now going to sue the force for wrongful arrest, as well as unlawful interference in his right to liberty. You can contribute to Julian’s crowdfunder here. We move on to discuss two ways in which the FSU has stepped in to help with free expression events: the Lewes Speakers Festival on Friday 9th May and the re-platforming of the ‘Licence to Offend’ cartoon exhibition. There is good news to report in the world of football where Cerys Vaughan has spoken out about her Kafkaesque trial after asking a transgender opponent: “Are you a man?”. Following a three-month battle, an appeal board of the FA quashed the ruling against her in a damning – and alarming – judgment on the original proceedings. As reported in the Telegraph, the written reasons state: she had not received a fair hearing during a three-hour video call that left her in tears; proper consideration had not been given to her age or the evidence against her; and she was wrongly found guilty “by own admission” when she had denied the charges. We end with an update on our event with Andrew Doyle on the 29th May, which is now both in-person and online.
‘That's Debatable!’  is edited by Jason Clift.

Journalism in the Dock

Tuesday Apr 29, 2025

Tuesday Apr 29, 2025

According to College of Policing guidance, Non-Crime Hate Incidents (NCHIs) help forces build an intelligence picture of community tensions and understand where they need to allocate resources for prevention. Indeed, during a House of Lords debate in November 2024, Lord Hanson, the Home Office minister, told peers: “It is vital that the police monitor non-crime hate incidents when proportionate and necessary to do so to help prevent serious crimes”. However, the Telegraph reports that freedom of information requests submitted to police by Harry Miller, the founder of Fair Cop, revealed that many of the biggest forces, including the Met, Greater Manchester and West Midlands do not actually analyse the NCHI data they collect. Meanwhile, the Conservatives are tabling an amendment to the Crime and Policing Bill to abolish non-crime hate incidents. FSU members can use our Campaigns tool to write to their MPs to urge them to vote for this amendment. In our next item, we discuss the barring of Renaud Camus, a French philosopher, from entering the UK due to his controversial views on immigration. Lord Young is quoted in the Telegraph, “We’ve reached out to him to see if he’d like any help in appealing this decision, and he said yes. So I anticipate that we are going to be getting an immigration lawyer on the case”. He adds, “I don’t think that the common good is endangered by inviting people to set out their contentious views in the public square, particularly not someone as distinguished as Mr Camus”. We end with a brief discussion on a new FSU briefing paper written by Trevor Kavanagh and entitled, “Journalism in the Dock, Sir Keir Starmer’s Baseless Prosecution of Tabloid Journalists as Director of Public Prosecutions”. The video of Monday’s FSU event, “Lifeblood of Democracy”, where we discussed the issues raised within the paper and Operation Elveden, will soon be available on our website.
‘That's Debatable!’  is edited by Jason Clift.

FSU Case Data Highlights

Tuesday Apr 15, 2025

Tuesday Apr 15, 2025

We have just completed our quarterly analysis of FSU casework and dive into the results of that during today’s episode. The first quarter of 2025 was our busiest ever with 411 new incidents received in the FSU inbox. This growth in caseload is directly related to the continuing increase in FSU active membership, which is now running at over 4,000 new members per quarter. ‘State Intervention’, which ranges from police contact and Non-Crime Hate Incidents through to arrest and prosecution, is a growing proportion of our work, representing 23% of new cases for the year to date, up from just 10% as recently as 2023. The good news is that, for cases that we see through from beginning to end, our member achieves a favourable outcome 80% of the time. We end the episode with a discussion on our third Belfast speakeasy that was held on Friday 11th April – the video should be up later in the week. We wish all our listeners and viewers a very Happy Easter!
‘That's Debatable!’  is edited by Jason Clift.

Pray for Shackleton!

Tuesday Apr 01, 2025

Tuesday Apr 01, 2025

Both The Times and Sky News have reported on a landmark ruling from the Office for Students (OfS), which has fined the University of Sussex a record £585,000 for “serious and significant” free speech failings in the case of Professor Kathleen Stock, accused of ‘transphobia’ for her gender-critical views. Professor Stock was forced out of the university in 2021 after a three-year campaign of bullying and character assassination. The OfS’s report denounces Sussex’s “trans and non-binary equality” statement for undermining academic freedom and creating a “chilling effect”. The report goes on: “An example of this effect in practice is the experience of Professor Stock. There were some views she did not feel able to express, and therefore teach, despite those views being lawful. Other staff and students may have felt similarly unable to express these, or other, lawful views.” Sussex’s Vice-Chancellor Sasha Roseneil reacted furiously, accusing the OfS of “free speech absolutism”. In our next item, reported in The Telegraph, we discuss an inclusivity guide issued to employees of the British Antarctic Survey (BAS) says that the “myth of meritocracy” asserts “race does not play a role in life successes” – and that the “belief that performance alone will be enough to earn recognition [and] promotion” can be a “microaggression”. In fact, even just saying “I believe the most qualified person should get the job” can count as “racial harassment”. We end with the news that Rangers FC is threatening lifetime bans after a group of fans displayed a banner reading “KEEP WOKE FOREIGN IDEOLOGIES OUT DEFEND EUROPE” during a recent Europa League tie at Ibrox. UEFA swiftly fined Rangers £25,000, describing the banner as “racist and/or discriminatory”. The story is discussed in Spiked by our digital communications director, Freddie Attenborough. If you’re a Rangers fan under investigation – or know someone who is – contact the FSU at help@freespeechunion.org. We end the episode with a round-up of forthcoming FSU events.
‘That's Debatable!’  is edited by Jason Clift.

Tuesday Mar 25, 2025

With the FSU’s support, the Chairman of the Metropolitan Police Federation – Rick Prior – is suing his own union after he was ‘cancelled’ for suggesting frontline officers are increasingly nervous about challenging people from ethnic minorities whom they suspect of breaking the law, given the spate of internal investigations into officers accused of being ‘racist’. Following an interview on GB News in October 2024 which led to his suspension, Mr Prior was also locked out of his emails and IT system and told he wasn’t allowed to speak to the press or comment on social media. As reported in The Telegraph and with the backing of the FSU, Mr Prior is taking legal action against the Police Federation of England & Wales and you can support Rick here. In other news, on Monday 17th March, the Online Safety Act’s latest phase of duties came into force. They require social media platforms – on pain of massive fines – to identify and remove illegal content. Sites must complete risk assessments detailing how they deal with illegal material and implement safety measures to deal with the risk. The Telegraph reports that dozens of small internet forums have already blocked British users or shut down as new online safety laws come into effect, with one comparing the new regime to a British version of China’s “great firewall”. Interestingly, the importance of internet forums and online anonymity was raised at our ‘From Faith to Faithless’ event last week. When labouring under the pervasive influence of a ‘high control’ religion, anonymous online communication becomes an essential ingredient for those taking their first tentative steps back to the wider world.  
‘That's Debatable!’  is edited by Jason Clift.

On Being Problematic

Tuesday Mar 18, 2025

Tuesday Mar 18, 2025

In a major win for workplace free speech, the Financial Conduct Authority (FCA) and the Prudential Regulation Authority (PRA) have abandoned plans to impose new diversity and inclusion rules on financial firms after strong pushback, including from the FSU. Had the proposals gone ahead, they would have placed sweeping new obligations on a significant portion of the UK’s financial sector. In January 2024, we responded to two parallel consultations (here and here), warning that the proposals would create a climate where employees felt unable to challenge radical progressive orthodoxies on a cluster of issues without fear of professional consequences. Our response to the FCA consultation was submitted via its online portal, but you can read our letter to the PRA here. We move on to discuss the case of Ben Woods, a member of the Free Speech Union (FSU), who has worked at Waitrose’s Henley branch in Oxfordshire for 25 years, having joined the supermarket as a teenager. However, after accusing its long-serving employee of misconduct over a dossier of more than 30 social media posts, the company has now swiftly suspended him. The case was reported in both The Telegraph and The Mail and you can support Ben’s s fundraiser page here. Thames Valley Police have admitted acting unlawfully in arresting an adult-education teacher at a local proclamation of the accession of King Charles in September 2022. Symon Hill, 47, was going home from church in Oxford on the Sunday morning three days after the death of Queen Elizabeth II when he found his way blocked by the ceremony. Following the public declaration of Charles as king, he called out from the back of the crowd: “Who elected him?” He then pursued legal action for wrongful arrest and has finally won his case, together with £2,500 in compensation. Now a trainee Baptist minister, Mr Hill (somewhat understatedly) said that he’d been “surprised” by the entire affair and by the two-and-a-half years it had taken the police to admit their mistake. We end the episode with a discussion on a report in The Telegraph that Donald Trump issued a sweeping executive order last Friday gutting the US Agency for Global Media (USAGM) – Voice of America’s parent agency – and several other government departments.
 ‘That's Debatable!’  is edited by Jason Clift.

Go Broke, Go Woke

Tuesday Mar 11, 2025

Tuesday Mar 11, 2025

A man arrested for burning a copy of the Koran in Bradford will not face charges, following intervention by the Free Speech Union. The man arrived in Britain as an asylum-seeker and, ironically, he was fleeing religious persecution in a Muslim majority country. After he uploaded a video of himself burning a Koran in a symbolic stand for freedom of speech and against Islamic extremism, West Yorkshire Police reacted swiftly – not to protect his right to protest, but to arrest him on suspicion of committing a criminal offence. The FSU intervened immediately, instructing a solicitor and covering our member’s legal fees. After several months, the police have now told him they’ll be taking no further action. Freddie Attenborough, our Digital Communications Director, has written about the case at length for The Conservative Woman. We are encouraging our supporters to write to their MP to encourage them to support an amendment tabled by The Opposition to scrap Clause 18 of the Employment Rights Bill. Clause 18 is a dangerous escalation in speech policing, disguised as a way to ‘protect’ vulnerable workers. It will force British businesses to monitor customer conversations or risk being sued for ‘third-party harassment’. Next, two recent stories from Cardiff University could serve as a parable for all that’s going wrong in British higher education. Either that, or a “Go Broke, Go Woke” parody. In story one, the university has announced plans to cut 400 academic jobs. In story two, there’s now a mandatory EDI module for all first-year Cardiff students. In other words, at the same time as the university is trying to get rid of academics who could teach students to think critically about received wisdoms, it’s somehow found the money to help EDI zealots impose them as dogma. The module provides a comprehensive guide to EDI-speak. Out, for example, go such “microaggressions” as complimenting somebody on their English. Also out are any idioms with an offensive ‘origin story’. We end the episode with a round-up of forthcoming FSU events.
‘That's Debatable!’  is edited by Jason Clift.

JD Vance's Valentine Speech

Tuesday Feb 25, 2025

Tuesday Feb 25, 2025

In a remarkably frank speech at the Munich Security Conference, US Vice President JD Vance warned that the greatest threat to Western democracies is not external aggression, but the erosion of free speech within them. Britain, he argued, was leading the charge in policing thought, with other European nations close behind. Invoking the Cold War, Mr Vance said that the West once defined itself in opposition to regimes that criminalised dissent and censored ‘heretical’ views – but now its governments are adopting such tactics themselves. Freddie Attenborough has written about the speech in detail here. As if on cue, The Telegraph reported on Saturday that the closure of two French TV stations had been confirmed by the Council of State, the Republic’s highest administrative court.
The FSU was proud to have a presence at the Association for Responsible Citizenship (ARC) Conference 2025, alongside many other civil rights and free expression advocacy groups. A key moment at the conference was the Free Speech dinner where our General Secretary, Lord Young, delivered the opening speech. The conference also provided the perfect platform to announce the launch of FSU International – an initiative designed to coordinate the efforts of existing FSUs around the world, and to support those looking to set up new ones. To drive the initiative forward, we’ve appointed Jon Benjamin, a former British Ambassador, to lead FSU International.
On Wednesday 19th February, in the heart of Westminster, the FSU marked its fifth anniversary with a packed gathering of supporters and donors. In just five years, the FSU has established itself as a leading voice for free expression, standing up for those targeted for wrongthink in an increasingly censorious culture while ensuring that the right to speak one’s mind is defended in the workplace and the public square.
We end with a round-up of forthcoming FSU events.
‘That's Debatable!’  is edited by Jason Clift.

17 Minutes of Courtroom Sanity

Tuesday Feb 11, 2025

Tuesday Feb 11, 2025

With the help of the FSU, a former Royal Marine who served in Iraq has been cleared of publishing threatening material with intent to stir up racial hatred – in reality, a 12-minute Facebook video urging people to stage peaceful protests about illegal immigration. Jamie Michael, an FSU member, was unanimously acquitted by a jury at Merthyr Tydfil Crown Court in just 17 minutes. The story was reported this week in The Telegraph. We paid his legal fees and arranged for him to be represented by solicitor Luke Gittos and barrister Adam King. Prosecutors claimed his language was “unrelentingly negative” towards immigrants, but his defence made clear that it was directed only at those who are “illegal, unchecked or radicalised”. The jury reached its verdict in 17 minutes, less time than it took to hear the prosecution’s opening arguments. FSU General Secretary Toby Young has written to the Chief Constable of Greater Manchester Police (GMP) on behalf of the FSU protesting its decision to release the name and street address of the man who was arrested on Monday for publicly burning the Koran. In the letter, Toby tells the Chief Constable: “As you must know, demonstrations involving damage to or the destruction of a Koran have been responded to with violence of the most serious kind. Just last week, an Iraqi man named Salwab Momika was murdered in Sweden after he burnt a Koran”. Meanwhile, Angela Rayner, in her role as communities secretary, is planning a new council on ‘Islamophobia’ and lining up ex-Tory attorney-general Dominic Grieve to chair it, according to The Telegraph. The 16-strong body will draw up an official government definition of Islamophobia. In 2018 Mr Grieve wrote a foreword to the report by the All-Party Parliamentary Group (APPG) on British Muslims which set out the controversial definition of Islamophobia later adopted by the Labour Party when it was in opposition. This definition has been widely criticised – including in a Free Speech Union briefing – for being far too broad and labelling perfectly legitimate criticisms of Islam ‘Islamophobic’. We end with a report that NHS staff have been told not to call people “obese” in an inclusive language guide produced by the medicines watchdog, the National Institute for Health and Care Excellence (NICE). The guide, reported in The Telegraph, instructs medical workers to describe the badly overweight as “people with obesity”. It also warns against using “diabetic”, and “alcoholic” rather than “people with diabetes” and “people who are dependent on alcohol”.
‘That's Debatable!’  is edited by Jason Clift.

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